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  • trufe

    i am all for any kind of civil disobedience targeted at LAZ

    wouldn’t it be great to organize a mass refusal to pay parking meters for a set day or week?

    now i am not against paying to park, the cost arguable should be even higher that it is – this would be a protest of the ridiculous deal the city made to sell off the meters

  • Fred

    Vandalism is vandalism. Even if “justifiable”.

    Brilliant! Really show the city by racking up millions of dollars in parking tickets! Are you also the kid that intentionally failed tests in school to “really show the teacher” when in reality you were just screwing yourself over?

  • The most effective protest would be for the city to stop enforcing meter violations. However, it’s probably in the contract that they can’t do that.

  • Fred

    Impractical for 2 reasons:
    1) Most tickets are written by CPM employees
    2) There’s no way the city would give up the revenue

  • Fred
  • trufe

    yes obviously it is illegal – that is kind of the whole point of civil disobedience.

    when the “victim” is a politically connected sham of a company leeching off of the public, I am not going to feel too bad about the vandalism

    as for the tickets, the point would be to get a crtitcal mass of people to join in so as to make ticketing enforcement close to impossible – what are they going to do, give boots to the entire city?

    like i said, getting that number of people coordinated is probably a pipe dream… but i can dream

  • trufe

    yeah, i would be surprised if there was not a clause of baseline expected # of city tickets issued, and more importantly, as fred points out, LAZ has their own enforcement corps

    god knows they can afford the employees

  • trufe

    as for #2 – i think if the city had good enough leadership taking the long view, it would be possible they would be willing to forgo the ticket revenue if it advanced the goal of getting out of this ridiculous contract

    but getting that type of leadership is even more of a pipe-dream than my idea

  • Fred

    Is CPM or the City responsible for meter vandalism? (serious question) I imagine some insurance company likely ends up footing the bill.

    I don’t understand how ticket enforcement becomes impossible. Unless the ticket writers’ thumbs fall off, they just continue writing tickets from shift start to shift end. Just because they can’t write a ticket for every single car that doesn’t pay a meter, I don’t seem them throwing their hands up in the air and quitting. Quadrupling the number of tickets written in a day is still a win for the city, even if that is only a single digit percentage of violators.

  • trufe

    also, possibly the most ridiculous part of the whole situation is the city acting like their hands are tied because of the contract.

    so they expect us to believe that in this town/state/federal district they wouldn’t be able to find a judge that would nullify the deal?

    chicago is not out of this contract because it does not want to be

  • Fred

    A poster in another thread mentioned that CPM has already made all of their money back, so every dollar now is just gravy. So assuming they are making enough money to cover their costs, and making even a modest profit on top of that, what is their motivation to get out of the contract? CPM holds all of the power. The city has zero leverage. Golden goose can’t taste that good and I have zero reason to believe they would do it as good corporate citizens.

  • trufe

    ok but now imagine that none of those tickets get paid. what does that do to the court docket? how do they keep up with attaching boots to cars? how many boots does the city need to buy?how long do they follow through if it is not generating any revenue

    people only pay meters in the first place because of the hassle of dealing with the consequences, if you have enough people who say screw it – we will just ignore the consequences, the system breaks down and the eventually the consequences disappear

    look i know it will never happen, most people dont even pay enough attention to get mad about the situation, let alone do anything about it

    but tactics like this do work if you get a significant, motivated population

  • trufe

    yeah CPM would never want to; hell, it is free money. but let’s say rahm came into office and decided he really wanted out of this deal – do you really think he wouldnt have found a way out of it?

  • Fred

    Cars only stay booted until a tow truck can come and take the car to an impound lot. So for this to work, the impound lot would have to get full enough that the city had no place to put the cars. Meanwhile, all of those people are without cars and racking up huge impound lot fines until they pay off all their tickets. The city gets paid when people get their cars back. So really, in order for this to work, people would have to abandon their cars in impound lots. Where do the consequences disappear?

  • trufe

    well, this is turning into a pretty silly conversation based on a hypothetical i threw out (that i already acknowledged would basically be impossible to coordinate), but:

    first of all a car does not get booted until they have 3 unpaid ticket convictions.

    the city issued ~6850 parking tickets per day in 2013. most people probably pay their tickets, but just for the sake of making a point, let’s say half do not, so that is ~3400 new court dates docketed per day

    if there is large scale noncompliance, there could easily be, what, 100,000 potential tickets per day? probably impossible to even issue that many, so let’s say 50k

    now if NONE of those people pay. that is 50k new court dates per day. that is more than tenfold

    i am sorry, but you cannot convince me that that is something the city of chicago could keep up with. there are not enough judges for one thing

    with large scale noncompliance it would take long enough to even get 3 tickets, let alone have 3 court dates scheduled

    even attempting to keep up would cost a LOT of money. at some point it is not worth the headache for the city if no new revenue is coming in

    again, the system of consequences/compliance is totally dependent on very, very high levels of compliance. if you remove that, the system is not sustainable

  • anon

    The link to the Richton Park Mayor article is wrong.

  • Fred

    It’s been awhile since I got a parking ticket, but I am pretty sure you don’t get a court date with every ticket. If I recall correctly, you get notification in the mail a week or two later and you have the following options:
    a) pay it and be done with it
    b) contest it in writing
    c) contest it in court (request a court date weeks in the future)
    d) ignore it

    This whole process takes several weeks, allowing plenty of time to get that magical third ticket/boot. Again, impound lot is the bottleneck, not the court.

  • ohsweetnothing

    Except I’d bet all the money in my name (not that much!) that this vandalism has nothing to do with the privatization of the meters and everything to do with the increased parking rates. That’s what Joe the Parker blames the meter deal for.

  • ohsweetnothing

    How would that help the City? Generally nullification of a contract means both parties are returned to their original positions before the contract was enacted. So no more private meters, but also the City would owe CPM the billion plus they paid…the billion plus the City has already spent.

  • trufe

    oh i completely agree. i just dont care why they are doing it, if it in any way hurts CPM, then i approve

  • trufe

    if you do not pay or contest in writing, there is a court date you are required to attend. if you do not show up, then a final determination is made. after 3 final determinations (or 2 that are both over 1 year old), you get a boot

  • trufe

    yeah they would have to do something crazy to raise the money, like increase the cost of parking and parking tickets. and then borrow against that future revenue. i guarantee they could get a better deal than the one they currently are “stuck” with.

    and CPM has obviously already had a lot of income from the deal, so that would offset some of the amount due anyway

  • Matt F

    I’ll play the devil’s advocate.

    see: boston tea party

  • BlueFairlane

    Unless we’re willing to follow up by fighting a nearly decade-long revolution, the comparison illustrates more wrong than right with the idea.

  • R.A. Stewart

    I would *never* ride a bike on LSD!

    It’s bad enough when my consciousness isn’t altered …

    Oh. *That* LSD.

    Never mind.